Episode Transcript
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Welcome to the Recombobulator Lab with Jason Graham-Nye and Chris Dominic.
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Jason just asked me if, what's going on in the United States and I said nothing.
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So what I'm going to say now is, hey, do you ever have Chinese balloons floating over your
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airspace?
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Old dialogue by me.
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Does that happen?
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I mean, they're closer to you.
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What was the quote?
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They can get away from a civilian and just suddenly float around.
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You don't have to, I mean.
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I'm with you.
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That's funny.
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I find it really funny how in authoritarian countries there's really no sense that you're
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ever going to be honest about it.
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The way Russia handles the war, the way China talks about every foreign policy thing, it's
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like, okay, yeah, sure.
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I'm totally with you.
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Lots of credibility there.
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No, but honestly, you guys are much closer to China.
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You're still not like right on China's door or anything.
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Well, I think there's nothing to see here.
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I mean, think about it.
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You put a balloon up.
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I mean, those things are huge and amazing.
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And you float it over Australia, well, 90% of the country is desert.
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It's like looking at Breaking Bad country.
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It's like there's nothing to see here.
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Literally, there's nothing to see here.
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How's it going, Dr. Chin?
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Well, other than Uluru, it's been kind of rough.
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We're waiting to hit the next coastal city.
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Oh, my God.
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Literally there's nothing to see here.
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Move on.
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And on it moves.
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Hey, what happened to that cycling back to all the planes?
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What happened to the graveyard of all of the Qantas planes?
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Actually, it wasn't just Qantas planes.
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It was a bunch of planes.
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Are they gone now?
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It was Singapore Airlines.
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Yeah, the Ayrsrock Airport is now empty and all those planes are being recommissioned.
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I think you might have heard that story that it was literally snakes on a plane and creatures
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on a plane.
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And you tried to seal them and they obviously can't seal them perfectly.
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So imagine that poor bastard.
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So the dude who runs operations at the airport, the sleepiest airport in the world, suddenly
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he's looking after 300 747s and he's like gets the call from Singapore Airlines going,
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OK, let's fire those bad boys up.
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And he's got to open the door.
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He opens the door and there's a lot of shuffling around of critters and creatures.
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Oh yeah.
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Yeah, it's a miracle he didn't die.
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Yeah, go ahead and go in there and just make sure there's no Australian deadly animals.
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As if the plane isn't living in their home.
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Right?
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That's something that's so funny.
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It's like, OK, dude, you just parked your plane in the middle of the bush.
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Anyway, that's awesome.
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Well, hey.
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That's so true.
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You know what we're doing today.
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We were just we're capping season two.
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We were just talking about the fact that we want double credit for season two episodes
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because that would get us the exact same amount of episodes that actually would be like one
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more I think because today's 17th.
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That'd be 34.
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We did 33 last season.
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And so then we'd be the same because I do think it is different post pandemic.
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In fact, one of the things that happened that Jason and I should probably share with you
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is that we pulled this off really only because we prerecorded a bazillion of these.
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And then while he went off to, gosh, where'd you go off to?
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He went off to several other countries and did other things.
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And we were all back.
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We had a nice little stack of these things in the corner all ready to go.
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And that's kind of the only way we pulled it off, right?
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Yeah.
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Because we suddenly, I mean, video the pandemic, like all good pandemics.
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I think we've all lived through many pandemics.
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I remember the 1971 is you have time and then the time just disappears post pandemic.
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And so the banking of episodes is kind of critical.
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So yeah, no, it's been yeah.
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It's actually kind of the opposite of that now actually, right?
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I mean, it's almost like the pent up demand makes things just crazy.
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I think in fact, Jason and I didn't even pull this particular episode off the way we planned.
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We were going to do this, what, a week ago or something and you're like, yeah, not going
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to happen, man.
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I'm so sorry.
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No, no.
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I mean, it was, you know, we didn't have a guest that we screwed or anything, so it didn't
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make any difference.
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But it's interesting just how different it is.
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But I'll tell you, I learned a ton.
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I mean, I can't believe how much I learned actually this year.
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These conversations were so fun and we had so many people who were so real.
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So I wanted to ask you just to kick this off.
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When you think back to what we had and what we learned and what we got out of a lot of
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these conversations, what were some of the highlights for you?
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Well I think the societal stuff, like the alcohol free piece, the fake meat thing.
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I just found those ones super, super interesting.
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And e-cigarettes.
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Those three things I just find amazing.
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Can we talk about that for a second?
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I listened to the e-cigarettes episode this morning.
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That is kind of terrifying actually.
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I mean, I was, she said twice on the show, she was like, yeah, there's DNA breaks we
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observed and you're talking about how they sell them in Australia under the premise that
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they don't have any nicotine in them, but they clearly do.
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I don't know.
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The whole, let me sell you the same addictive substance but dress it up so that you think
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it's different is really, really interesting.
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And then there are these health harms that I think it's interesting that we haven't heard
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more about them.
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Right?
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I mean, she's clearly perfectly comfortable talking about it, but wow.
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I don't know, that to me really punched me in the face.
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I'm with you.
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And I find like if you drew a theme through so many of the conversations we had, it's
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like there are facts around so many of these things and yet they don't rise to the surface
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and the general public don't know about them.
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Like around the concussion, for example, the e-cigarettes thing or the tiny sachets that
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we had in Indonesia with Yobelle.
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We know it, but we don't do anything about it.
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It's incredible.
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Yeah, or Guns and Gambling.
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That was a great episode.
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I loved it.
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Yeah, we finally got that out of the way after talking about that for I think a year.
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You know what's interesting about this whole societal thing that we covered, these very
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subtle elements of it, I do think there is this problem with humans and things where
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causal links are delayed.
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It's a really fascinating thing that kind of comes up in my work sometimes when you're
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dealing with lawsuits about it because, I'll give you an example.
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Smoking is an interesting one because the health effects of smoking take years to usually
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get you.
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Then when it finally gets you, then you have regret, but there wasn't anything at the time
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that sort of got you there.
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You get to your old Brenner's situation and he's like, oh, now that it's killing me, I
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definitely regret this.
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Before that, we struggle with it.
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If you felt sick every time you took a puff of a cigarette, you probably wouldn't smoke.
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There's this issue with causation and distance.
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I was thinking about it, the environment.
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There's not an earthquake the second after you do something seismologically like frack
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or something.
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When putting CO2 in the air, you don't see with your own eyes that this is doing something.
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You eat too much food.
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You don't feel fatter immediately.
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It's just one of those things where, what are we going to do?
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That's the thread.
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I think what it is, is we don't recognize, we fundamentally don't recognize that we live
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in a system and that there's a complexity to the systems.
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We need to develop systems thinking, which we do not have at school.
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It is like cause-effect.
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I do this, then something should happen very soon.
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If it doesn't happen soon, maybe that's okay.
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Then 20 years of smoking, it's like, oh, that's probably not okay.
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I think the newest part of our brain, not the base of the brain, but the newest part
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does the problem-solving and the logic piece, I think it does a terrible job of recognizing
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that we're in a system.
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Now, whether that's a system like the natural world that we live in, in 200 years, we have
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absolutely devastated this planet.
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Just 200 years.
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It's crazy, right?
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You know that analogy where we're like two minutes to midnight?
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If you think of the history of the planet, in the last three seconds, we have devastated
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the planet.
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What's fascinating is that we're so arrogant to say we've got to save the planet.
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It's like, no, no, the planet's going to be fine.
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If we could just all die quickly, then the planet's going to recover beautifully because
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that's what systems do.
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They can recover.
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We as a species are really up against it.
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We don't recognize the world we live in, and it's that detached analytical thinking, that
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Cartesian thinking from 300 or 400 years ago where we pull ourselves out of a situation,
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we look at it, we analyze it.
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We don't recognize we're a part of it.
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It's a bit like modern medicine, right?
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Western medicine is like rather than the holistic Chinese medicine, which is like it's a whole
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system.
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It's like, I'm going to be a specialist in back surgery.
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You don't recognize that, well, it's not just one whole thing.
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We just can't do this specialized.
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You need to think of it holistically.
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That's a great, that's a really, really good analogy because every time I have gone to
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a physical therapist for some sports injury or something like that, I'm always stunned
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at how well those people understand how things are all connected in your body.
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You'll be like, why are you working on the part of my body that doesn't hurt?
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They'll be like, well, you'll know this tomorrow because this thing is connected to that thing.
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Those people have done some amazing work, at least for me, over the years.
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I can't believe what a valuable profession they have.
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I think part of it is because they do kind of understand how that all works.
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They just have to.
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Yeah.
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Yeah, they have to.
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Right.
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Back to this idea, trying to be optimistic because I am pro-human.
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Chris, I'm done.
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Chris, I'm done.
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I'm out.
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I'm out.
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I'm out.
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It's funny you say that because I do have this conversation with people sometimes.
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I talk about the problem of when you look at all of these issues, and they're important
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issues to look at, but after a while, if you don't tell yourself, yeah, but humans can
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do amazing things.
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We're capable of all this awesome love and wonderful things.
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We heard with one of our guests.
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We asked, I believe it was Yobelle.
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We were like, how do you deal with the fact that this is so grim?
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He goes, you just got to be hopeful and you've got to, whatever you do, you just got to think
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about love.
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I was like, yeah.
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Because we've got our families, we've got our friends, and that is the coolest thing.
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We do these amazing things like create the internet, which then causes all sorts of problems.
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It's so great that we did it, but then it's like, oh.
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Just today, I was looking at this incredible graphic of this thing that puts us in perspective
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with the rest of the universe.
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Oh, yeah.
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Okay.
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It is just, at first, you're like, wow, that is such an effective demonstrative exhibit
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because I'm thinking like my job.
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Then I, and some things really aren't really explainable by the voice or by the text or
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whatever.
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You really need to see certain things with your eyes.
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Then I thought, oh, I hope I don't make people feel terribly small when I share this with
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them because it really does make you go, oh, wow.
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Even the entire earth is so small.
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Even our sun is technically a dwarf sun, a dwarf star.
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Things like that, it's like, oh, God.
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All right.
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It just keeps going.
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You think we're getting done with this pretty soon.
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This thing from the new space telescope, it just keeps getting bigger and bigger and bigger.
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You're like, oh, my God.
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You get at the end like these supermassive black holes.
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Anyway, you get the idea.
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I think there's a huge mental health benefit in reminding ourselves every week of that
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thing that we're small, but it's amazing.
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It's just the amazingness of it all.
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If you can create wonder every week, remembering them.
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Right.
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I think that's really good.
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I think it's an element of cognitive behavior therapy that I think we might have heard this
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from Doug Keane, but I can't remember where we were talking about this.
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He's like, you can always reframe this in your mind.
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It's the point you made about the prefrontal lobe in our brain is not, it feels like the
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challenge with it is it's capable of great things, but you have to tell it to wake up.
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It doesn't seem to do things on its own.
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You have to go, all right, wait a minute.
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Let me think about this for a second.
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If you don't do that, if you just go with what your natural reaction to things are and
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you don't second process that through that advanced part of your brain, then that takes
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extra work.
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It takes extra work to take something that you're reacting to and then reframe it and
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go, wait a minute.
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Yes.
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Isn't there another way to see it?
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I think that's, it's funny because you and I have both managed people.
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One of the things I always remember teaching young managers is don't tell people, as much
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as you can avoid it, don't tell people not to do things.
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Tell them what they should do.
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If they are supposed to pull the blue button and they're supposed to push the red button
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and you say, hey, don't pull the blue button.
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The problem with that is you leave them with blue button, which is in their mind now and
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really all you're supposed to do is take the extra step to instead of, the first thing
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you will think is, say don't do that.
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That's the first thing that enters your mind.
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That's like your mammal talking.
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Then if you stop for a second and say, no, just tell them to push the blue button.
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You have to take that extra step.
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Is it more memorable because you're telling them what to do instead of what not to do?
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It's more positive.
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It's less demeaning and scary.
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It's just, anyway, I think the whole thing is fascinating to me what a thread ran through
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all of these societal subjects.
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I think one of the things you said was around reacting.
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There's a whole different world of reacting versus responding.
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The seconds that if you can just take that breath, if you can just take that to reframe
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a really bad situation or to, if we live in a reactive world, bad things happen, right?
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Bad things happen.
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That reaction, which is I think flight fight, which is the base of your brain, like, if
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you can just hit pause and think a little bit further, you're going to come out with
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a much better outcome.
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It's trying to do, and that's the whole basis of meditation and a whole bunch of other things
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that you can bring into your life.
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Stepping back and looking at our season of episodes, it's been a fascinating season looking
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at where the world's going, there was some elements around technology, around how we
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eat, how we drink.
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My son turned 18 on Sunday and in my day, I was drinking since I was like 15 and it
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was a very boozy Australian culture.
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There was a statistic that 30% of young people are never drinkers, never drinkers.
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30% are very intentional drinkers, like they will only drink one or two because they don't
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want to hang over and 30% drink like you and me, low functioning alcoholics.
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My son went and had his... Sunday he turns 18.
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Do you think he ran to the pub on Sunday night?
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Nope.
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He finally yesterday, which is my Wednesday night, he went down to the local RSL where
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you and I have had a beer.
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He had half a beer.
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He didn't even finish the beer and he came home.
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I think it's a fascinating thing.
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Here's what's so interesting about that.
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Alcohol is way on the way down but nicotine is way on the up.
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That's a weird replacement.
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It's terrifying.
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The doctor that we had on looking at the pulmonary, the health issues, the idea that a vape and
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a cigarette is 60 to 120 chemicals.
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It's a chemical bomb.
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That little cartridge is one packet of cigarettes so you could mindlessly bang through three
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or four cartridges a day, which is like three packets of cigarettes.
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It's kind of like in alcohol, it's like when you're drinking a really big beer or something
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like that.
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You're not thinking about the fact that you just had six beers.
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You don't want to think about it either.
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The reality is this shift is interesting.
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Why would... Of course, we never got to this question but why would you have some health
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process which is like, okay, I'm associating drinking with more... Not drinking with a
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healthier life.
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Your son's a surfer.
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I could see him being into being a healthy dude.
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He's probably got a bunch of friends who vape.
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Maybe he doesn't but it sounds like if the odds are what the odds are, maybe.
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He has to.
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You got to wonder is that because they don't realize how bad it is for you or is it just
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... I don't know.
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Who knows?
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Or because they don't care.
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Maybe because it's like with young people, there's always a certain amount of giving
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the finger to society.
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That's half the fun.
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Do you guys call it the finger?
333
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You guys don't probably call it the finger.
334
00:20:19,520 --> 00:20:20,520
Yeah.
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00:20:20,520 --> 00:20:21,520
No, we don't.
336
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I think so.
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It's nice to know you're on board with the finger.
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00:20:23,520 --> 00:20:37,600
One of the best jokes I've heard recently was this guy talking in a particular comedy
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piece where he said, and then his finger, he locked off his finger.
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He couldn't have a middle finger anymore which meant that he was incapable of driving in
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Boston anytime soon.
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That's a good one.
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That is a good one.
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I thought you don't really see it coming.
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If we go way back, if we go way back to the beginning, I was thinking about how much... I'll
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just say it.
347
00:21:03,840 --> 00:21:07,720
How brave and awesome Zane Lamprey was to just be straight with us on what he thought
348
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about taking offense in comedy and what it really means and the realities of it and how
349
00:21:13,820 --> 00:21:17,640
it gets overhyped certain times and where it's legit.
350
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I thought that was really cool that he put that out there.
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I was thinking about themes.
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I think for the vast majority of our participants were really real with us.
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That's really what we've always been going for.
354
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It's an evidence-based thing.
355
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It's as humorous as we can possibly make it with serious subjects and people have got
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to be real.
357
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I think we've got that.
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I agree.
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I think that question around buster myth for us was such a cool mechanism to get at some
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of these big things.
361
00:21:53,080 --> 00:21:55,120
I'm stuck on e-cigarettes for some reason.
362
00:21:55,120 --> 00:21:58,760
The idea that people are talking... It was really recently.
363
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It's just water vapor.
364
00:22:00,800 --> 00:22:02,800
I just think that's like, oh yeah, I've heard that.
365
00:22:02,800 --> 00:22:03,800
I've heard that so much.
366
00:22:03,800 --> 00:22:05,760
Oh yeah, it's just water vapor.
367
00:22:05,760 --> 00:22:09,000
It's just something fun to do.
368
00:22:09,000 --> 00:22:15,600
By the way, would I tell you that if I was someone who probably didn't have a very good
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moral compass and was trying to sell a lot of things to people and make them addicts?
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Particularly if I'm outside the realm of the law and I'm in some other country that you
371
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can't get at me or whatever.
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00:22:28,240 --> 00:22:33,160
I was also thinking about... I'll give you an example.
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Doug Keene's no fan of authoritarianism, but I thought he gave the authoritarianism
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versus democracy reality a very good setup.
375
00:22:44,680 --> 00:22:47,680
He didn't bang on about any particular political thing.
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He just said, here's what's going on psychologically with it.
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I thought that was also really refreshing.
378
00:22:57,160 --> 00:22:59,200
We've learned a lot from him.
379
00:22:59,200 --> 00:23:04,560
Was his conclusion that authoritarianism rises when the populace is fearful?
380
00:23:04,560 --> 00:23:07,720
I think it was... No, not really.
381
00:23:07,720 --> 00:23:12,920
I think you could probably extrapolate that from the conversation.
382
00:23:12,920 --> 00:23:20,880
I think what he was talking about in particular was that... I thought the theme was authoritarianism
383
00:23:20,880 --> 00:23:26,520
is a political system and it is something to be concerned about if you value democracy.
384
00:23:26,520 --> 00:23:33,920
It's also an element of what humans... Some humans need a certain amount of... There's
385
00:23:33,920 --> 00:23:38,080
a strong leader who makes this decision at this point.
386
00:23:38,080 --> 00:23:43,480
He didn't use this example, but the example I was thinking of was again, management consulting
387
00:23:43,480 --> 00:23:47,440
kind of stuff where we used to talk about there's basically three different types of
388
00:23:47,440 --> 00:23:49,140
decisions that you can make.
389
00:23:49,140 --> 00:23:53,600
You can make a consult decision, which is kind of in the middle.
390
00:23:53,600 --> 00:23:58,160
It's like where you go, hey, Jason, what do you think about this?
391
00:23:58,160 --> 00:23:59,700
I got to make a decision about this.
392
00:23:59,700 --> 00:24:03,260
Would you tell me what you think and then I'll make my decision?
393
00:24:03,260 --> 00:24:04,520
That's the consult decision.
394
00:24:04,520 --> 00:24:08,240
The consensus decision is the one that takes the longest, but it's probably the best because
395
00:24:08,240 --> 00:24:10,040
you get everybody.
396
00:24:10,040 --> 00:24:11,440
You get everybody involved.
397
00:24:11,440 --> 00:24:16,100
Then there's the command decision, which is usually not as good, but necessary because
398
00:24:16,100 --> 00:24:17,100
of time.
399
00:24:17,100 --> 00:24:22,400
The best example I can think of is duck.
400
00:24:22,400 --> 00:24:25,320
If I go, duck, and you say, why?
401
00:24:25,320 --> 00:24:30,880
Which is what a lot of people will do.
402
00:24:30,880 --> 00:24:34,000
It's probably too late.
403
00:24:34,000 --> 00:24:38,360
Sometimes you need a strong leader to yell, duck.
404
00:24:38,360 --> 00:24:44,360
I would say the way corporate cultures have developed over the years, there's a real
405
00:24:44,360 --> 00:24:48,160
preference for consensus decisions on everything.
406
00:24:48,160 --> 00:24:51,480
The problem is that doesn't really work.
407
00:24:51,480 --> 00:24:56,480
It works for a lot of things, but the reality is there's a lot of times where you need to
408
00:24:56,480 --> 00:24:57,800
do a consult decision.
409
00:24:57,800 --> 00:25:03,800
I'd say at least once a year, there's a command decision out there that's got to happen.
410
00:25:03,800 --> 00:25:10,880
Why do so many people not like command decisions, I've discovered?
411
00:25:10,880 --> 00:25:13,480
It's because it's authoritarian.
412
00:25:13,480 --> 00:25:15,200
It freaks some people out.
413
00:25:15,200 --> 00:25:23,760
It's like, whoa, you should have to explain to me why I have to duck.
414
00:25:23,760 --> 00:25:25,040
Which is really interesting.
415
00:25:25,040 --> 00:25:29,100
I'm not sure if this is a correlation with the younger generation where everyone feels
416
00:25:29,100 --> 00:25:31,280
like they need to have a say in every decision.
417
00:25:31,280 --> 00:25:36,760
I'm not sure if that's every generation, the younger generation feels that or this particular
418
00:25:36,760 --> 00:25:40,320
generation feels like everyone wants ownership in a decision.
419
00:25:40,320 --> 00:25:45,280
In Japanese culture, there's a thing called temawashi and that is absolutely 90% of decisions
420
00:25:45,280 --> 00:25:50,280
in Japanese companies are consultative and take forever.
421
00:25:50,280 --> 00:25:52,040
The negative is it takes forever.
422
00:25:52,040 --> 00:25:54,040
The positive is everyone's got buy-in.
423
00:25:54,040 --> 00:25:55,640
There is no complaint.
424
00:25:55,640 --> 00:25:57,640
There is no one saying, I didn't have a say.
425
00:25:57,640 --> 00:25:59,560
It's like, no, no, you really did.
426
00:25:59,560 --> 00:26:00,560
That's fascinating.
427
00:26:00,560 --> 00:26:01,560
That's very interesting.
428
00:26:01,560 --> 00:26:08,840
You know what, for some reason that reminded me of, even though I don't know why, Mike
429
00:26:08,840 --> 00:26:14,320
Hanley, when we asked him, is the Be Real app the kind of thing that's going to turn
430
00:26:14,320 --> 00:26:18,000
into something or is it just going to get replaced by one of the other big tools?
431
00:26:18,000 --> 00:26:20,760
He goes, oh, it'll be replaced.
432
00:26:20,760 --> 00:26:22,240
Like flat out.
433
00:26:22,240 --> 00:26:26,200
I was like, oh, all right.
434
00:26:26,200 --> 00:26:27,200
That's so funny.
435
00:26:27,200 --> 00:26:29,120
No fear at all.
436
00:26:29,120 --> 00:26:30,800
I thought that was fantastic.
437
00:26:30,800 --> 00:26:33,880
It was and there's no revenue model in it.
438
00:26:33,880 --> 00:26:38,320
I've not used it since then because it's so boring.
439
00:26:38,320 --> 00:26:41,960
It goes being once a day, you take a photo of yourself, a photo of what you are.
440
00:26:41,960 --> 00:26:48,280
It's like after five days, it's like, I'm so bored and I don't care where you are.
441
00:26:48,280 --> 00:26:52,000
You started to realize that to you, it was a waste of your time.
442
00:26:52,000 --> 00:26:53,000
That's what you were thinking.
443
00:26:53,000 --> 00:26:55,120
You were like, oh, God.
444
00:26:55,120 --> 00:26:58,120
I don't need to give up my time anymore.
445
00:26:58,120 --> 00:27:05,600
I was drawn to it because it's like with the other ones where it's like if the app is free,
446
00:27:05,600 --> 00:27:09,680
then you're the product because they're selling your data.
447
00:27:09,680 --> 00:27:12,200
With Be Real, it's like, well, they're not serving up ads.
448
00:27:12,200 --> 00:27:13,200
That's good.
449
00:27:13,200 --> 00:27:15,080
Then it's like there's no revenue model.
450
00:27:15,080 --> 00:27:18,880
They're just aggregating lots of people and then they're going to flick it to someone.
451
00:27:18,880 --> 00:27:23,840
As Mike said, it's like, yeah, Instagram can knock this off like tomorrow for nothing.
452
00:27:23,840 --> 00:27:25,760
Now, they haven't yet.
453
00:27:25,760 --> 00:27:30,760
But still, I love the fact that he, like everybody I thought, was just super real with us.
454
00:27:30,760 --> 00:27:33,680
It was really fun.
455
00:27:33,680 --> 00:27:34,680
What do you think?
456
00:27:34,680 --> 00:27:40,640
What's coming up for you in the post podcast world?
457
00:27:40,640 --> 00:27:42,960
You're doing all sorts of different things.
458
00:27:42,960 --> 00:27:44,920
I am.
459
00:27:44,920 --> 00:27:49,960
We've got projects up in the South Pacific on the nappy front, which is exciting, World
460
00:27:49,960 --> 00:27:52,560
Bank project, which is kind of cool.
461
00:27:52,560 --> 00:28:00,720
I am toying potentially with another podcast with my son called Teach Me Everything, which
462
00:28:00,720 --> 00:28:06,080
is an idea where I've got four university degrees, I'm 53, and I understand less and
463
00:28:06,080 --> 00:28:08,040
less about the world.
464
00:28:08,040 --> 00:28:12,200
I thought having a young person like my 18-year-old son, and we might have a guest or two I want
465
00:28:12,200 --> 00:28:15,880
to talk about, what is Deepop?
466
00:28:15,880 --> 00:28:18,400
What is Discord?
467
00:28:18,400 --> 00:28:20,240
How does someone do online dating?
468
00:28:20,240 --> 00:28:21,240
Because that's beyond me.
469
00:28:21,240 --> 00:28:25,880
There's a raft of things that I don't get.
470
00:28:25,880 --> 00:28:26,880
I think it's interesting.
471
00:28:26,880 --> 00:28:31,480
It flips the idea of mentor-mentee on its head, because typically a mentor is older,
472
00:28:31,480 --> 00:28:34,360
and the older mentor teaches the mentee something.
473
00:28:34,360 --> 00:28:41,320
But I think nowadays, the digital natives, and you and my generation is the last generation.
474
00:28:41,320 --> 00:28:45,600
We were born in pre-digital land, and now we've had to figure it out.
475
00:28:45,600 --> 00:28:47,080
Digital natives just see the world differently.
476
00:28:47,080 --> 00:28:49,440
I think there's something in there.
477
00:28:49,440 --> 00:28:55,320
We're tinkering around with that, which is quite exciting.
478
00:28:55,320 --> 00:28:57,680
I would totally be a fan of that.
479
00:28:57,680 --> 00:28:58,680
No, really.
480
00:28:58,680 --> 00:29:00,960
If you put that out, I'll listen to it.
481
00:29:00,960 --> 00:29:02,560
That sounds great.
482
00:29:02,560 --> 00:29:07,080
What we're actually doing, we're trying to go to Udemy or Khan Academy, some of these
483
00:29:07,080 --> 00:29:10,120
big online-listed businesses.
484
00:29:10,120 --> 00:29:15,480
You know you can do so many online courses at very low cost, and see if they'll sponsor
485
00:29:15,480 --> 00:29:16,480
us.
486
00:29:16,480 --> 00:29:17,480
It's a neat idea.
487
00:29:17,480 --> 00:29:22,920
Udemy is interesting, because they don't have a podcast, and podcasting is a really cheap,
488
00:29:22,920 --> 00:29:27,960
effective, but entertaining way to bring new customers in for them.
489
00:29:27,960 --> 00:29:30,720
We're toying with, can we get some corporate sponsorship, maybe?
490
00:29:30,720 --> 00:29:31,720
We'll see.
491
00:29:31,720 --> 00:29:32,720
What about you, young Chris?
492
00:29:32,720 --> 00:29:33,720
Love it.
493
00:29:33,720 --> 00:29:36,080
Are you fighting justice?
494
00:29:36,080 --> 00:29:40,080
I'm doing justice through the help of legal teams.
495
00:29:40,080 --> 00:29:42,120
That's a joke.
496
00:29:42,120 --> 00:29:46,080
There's an old retired jury consultant who used to say that.
497
00:29:46,080 --> 00:29:47,080
He was from Texas.
498
00:29:47,080 --> 00:29:48,640
They'd say, what are you doing?
499
00:29:48,640 --> 00:29:50,640
He'd say, we're doing justice.
500
00:29:50,640 --> 00:29:55,960
I always thought that was pretty entertaining.
501
00:29:55,960 --> 00:29:56,960
It's pretty good.
502
00:29:56,960 --> 00:29:57,960
No, yeah.
503
00:29:57,960 --> 00:30:02,800
We're really having fun.
504
00:30:02,800 --> 00:30:12,640
We're working really hard to push the limits on putting together better technology, better
505
00:30:12,640 --> 00:30:14,800
processes.
506
00:30:14,800 --> 00:30:19,480
We're just trying to stay as edgy as we possibly can.
507
00:30:19,480 --> 00:30:22,640
For some reason, that's the kind of thing that keeps me fired up.
508
00:30:22,640 --> 00:30:29,300
I love the mission of being one, just a little bit out in front.
509
00:30:29,300 --> 00:30:33,840
Even if it's impractical sometimes, and even if, I don't know, for some reason that's really
510
00:30:33,840 --> 00:30:35,240
fun.
511
00:30:35,240 --> 00:30:40,960
If you're always thinking, all right, what would help the clients learn more?
512
00:30:40,960 --> 00:30:45,720
I will say, since I don't know if I've ever said this on the show, now is probably a good
513
00:30:45,720 --> 00:30:47,760
time to say it.
514
00:30:47,760 --> 00:30:53,480
One of the things I really like about our profession is, this doesn't get talked about
515
00:30:53,480 --> 00:30:57,200
as much on the show like bull or something where people like, that's what people think
516
00:30:57,200 --> 00:30:59,080
the stuff is.
517
00:30:59,080 --> 00:31:03,160
When you work with some witness who is really having a hard time explaining themselves,
518
00:31:03,160 --> 00:31:07,120
and they're being hit with all these loaded questions from attorneys who do this stuff
519
00:31:07,120 --> 00:31:13,240
every day, and you work with them, with the attorney, and they start to actually learn
520
00:31:13,240 --> 00:31:20,000
how they can do this in a way where they don't sound like they're scared, and they don't
521
00:31:20,000 --> 00:31:30,000
sound like they're stammering, or they don't sound defensive, which can really give people
522
00:31:30,000 --> 00:31:33,360
an inaccurate view of somebody.
523
00:31:33,360 --> 00:31:39,760
I feel like we can help level the playing field for people, for witnesses.
524
00:31:39,760 --> 00:31:46,240
I feel like we can really help level the playing field for, we can help jurors understand this
525
00:31:46,240 --> 00:31:48,520
incredibly complex stuff we've got to do sometimes.
526
00:31:48,520 --> 00:31:55,160
When we're working on patent cases and stuff, I love feeling like, you know what, we're
527
00:31:55,160 --> 00:32:00,040
going to make this, this jury is going to, we're going to make this jury is not just
528
00:32:00,040 --> 00:32:04,120
understanding this, but they're maybe even a little entertained by it, when in fact when
529
00:32:04,120 --> 00:32:09,960
they probably first heard, Mr. Jury, this case is, what they really want to hear is,
530
00:32:09,960 --> 00:32:10,960
this is a murder case.
531
00:32:10,960 --> 00:32:14,800
Or, you know, what they really want to hear, and you know what they get, and they're like,
532
00:32:14,800 --> 00:32:19,680
this is a technology patent case, and people are like, oh, like, no.
533
00:32:19,680 --> 00:32:24,920
Now, sure, all the evidence suggests that when they actually are seated for the jury,
534
00:32:24,920 --> 00:32:28,840
they're all in, and they want to work hard, and they want to do a good job, but prior
535
00:32:28,840 --> 00:32:36,080
to, you know, being seated, I'm sure they're thinking, ooh, two weeks talking about technology
536
00:32:36,080 --> 00:32:37,080
in a courtroom?
537
00:32:37,080 --> 00:32:43,320
I mean, anyway, so I get all fired up sometimes when I'm, when I'm fired up, I get fired up
538
00:32:43,320 --> 00:32:48,000
about the fact that I think we're doing work that is, it's good for people.
539
00:32:48,000 --> 00:32:53,000
It isn't just something you have to do because the legal system exists.
540
00:32:53,000 --> 00:32:54,440
Something we're trying to do well.
541
00:32:54,440 --> 00:32:58,040
So anyway, that's, I think that's, yeah.
542
00:32:58,040 --> 00:33:01,560
That's very cool, and that's, yeah, yeah, that's so cool.
543
00:33:01,560 --> 00:33:02,560
Well, congratulations.
544
00:33:02,560 --> 00:33:04,680
It's going to be an exciting 2023 for you.
545
00:33:04,680 --> 00:33:05,680
Yes.
546
00:33:05,680 --> 00:33:09,160
And I think, I think there could be a chance of a season three if you and I were to be
547
00:33:09,160 --> 00:33:10,160
able to do that.
548
00:33:10,160 --> 00:33:11,160
That would be exciting.
549
00:33:11,160 --> 00:33:14,480
There's, I'm never going to say never.
550
00:33:14,480 --> 00:33:15,480
That's right.
551
00:33:15,480 --> 00:33:16,480
Never say never.
552
00:33:16,480 --> 00:33:17,480
Yep.
553
00:33:17,480 --> 00:33:18,480
Because who knows what could happen?
554
00:33:18,480 --> 00:33:23,560
Plus, I'll tell you, Jason, I just, I'll sign off by saying I always look forward to doing
555
00:33:23,560 --> 00:33:24,640
this with you.
556
00:33:24,640 --> 00:33:29,720
You are a great guy to be able to hang out with all the way across the world digitally.
557
00:33:29,720 --> 00:33:34,920
I'm very, feel so blessed to have met you all those years ago with our kids in the same
558
00:33:34,920 --> 00:33:37,680
school and we always said, wouldn't it be fun to work together?
559
00:33:37,680 --> 00:33:42,880
And then we basically manifested the pandemic, we're sorry, but we manifested the pandemic
560
00:33:42,880 --> 00:33:44,160
to get the podcast going.
561
00:33:44,160 --> 00:33:47,160
Yeah, it's, I mean, it helped us get great ratings.
562
00:33:47,160 --> 00:33:48,160
Yeah, exactly.
563
00:33:48,160 --> 00:33:49,160
Go pandemic.
564
00:33:49,160 --> 00:33:50,160
So yeah, see.
565
00:33:50,160 --> 00:33:57,360
Anybody who thought that we were good guys was just like, oh, I think if these guys had
566
00:33:57,360 --> 00:34:02,160
a vaping company, they'd be killing it.
567
00:34:02,160 --> 00:34:04,400
It'd be awesome.
568
00:34:04,400 --> 00:34:08,040
Well, we've overstayed our welcome to our very consistent.
569
00:34:08,040 --> 00:34:09,040
We have.
570
00:34:09,040 --> 00:34:11,920
Yeah, so I will see you soon.
571
00:34:11,920 --> 00:34:15,360
I'm looking for opportunities that you and I will get together in person as hard as that
572
00:34:15,360 --> 00:34:16,360
is.
573
00:34:16,360 --> 00:34:23,640
But in the meantime, good luck on your endeavors and thanks for a great season too.
574
00:34:23,640 --> 00:34:25,000
That was a wonderful season too.
575
00:34:25,000 --> 00:34:26,000
Thank you.
576
00:34:26,000 --> 00:34:27,000
Thanks everyone.
577
00:34:27,000 --> 00:34:28,000
Bye everybody.
578
00:34:28,000 --> 00:34:35,000
Thank you for joining us at the Recombobulator Lab with Chris Dominic and Jason Graham-Nye.
579
00:34:35,000 --> 00:34:36,000
Catch you next time.
580
00:34:36,000 --> 00:34:36,240
Stay blessed und
